with the military people. and in talking about veterans and jobs, the work of michelle obama and jill biden, he's bridged this international and domestic divide in ways -- >> i think you're right. the idea of the first lady and dr. biden, the second lady if you will, making a point of almost like in a civil war setting. that women taking an interest in mostly guys are getting injured badly or killed. and being out there and addressing them as individuals that are important years after the battle. >> and that is what's so unpleasant, distasteful if you will, about romney's reply on fox. when he -- imagine you're a troop in afghanistan. you know, it's 110 degrees. you're walking around with a pack and a weapon. imagine you have a loved one who is. and you hear him or her referred to as a laundry list. that's a dehumanizing of what these people are doing. to romney it's just another issue. i don't need to deal with this issue in this speech. it's not a laundry list. it's human beings. >> i like to think -- i remember this story of a super bowl game. i'm watching the pilots go over when they do it.